Greg Price’s Arguments for the Lawfulness of “The Oath” and the Many “Excommunications”
From: Greg Price
Date: Jan 3, 2007 12:40 PM
Subject: A Final Personal Plea
To: Laura Harr , Darren Harr
Cc: Greg Price < covpastor@yahoo.ca>, Lyndon Dohms , Greg Barrow
Dear Darren and Laura,
This is a rather long personal letter from me and not from the Session. I don’t know what I can add to what we as a Session have already said in our Public Response (October 29, 2006), but I will seek to add what we have already written as well as a little more for your consideration. I cite that section for you to review, and plead with you to reconsider your position.
I do love you both dearly in the Lord and this is most difficult for me, and yet I firmly believe (before the Court of Heaven) that the Oath is both lawful and the Court imposing the Oath is lawful as well.
What follows is the section from our Public Response (October 29, 2006) to which you have not yet specifically responded to our arguments (at least I have not seen it in any of your responses).
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The Oath
The Oath that was sent to the Society in Prince George was essentially reaffirming what every member under the inspection of this Session must affirm and did affirm when joining with us initially:
(1) Submission to its lawful authority as the Ordinance of Christ, and
(2) Reception of the Terms of Membership and the Terms of Communion (including all judicial acts and position papers) without any known disagreement. These two points were fundamental to membership in the PRCE (beginning in 1996). These two points were fundamental to membership in the RPNA when we were a greater Presbytery. Furthermore, these two points did not cease with the dissolution of our greater Presbytery, but are presently fundamental to membership in the RPNA (GM) as was made clear in the letter (June 14, 2003) that was sent to the Societies and members after the dissolution of the Presbytery wherein it asks and answers questions related to both membership and government.
We ask [in the letter of June 14, 2006--GLP]:
“Has the dissolution of the Presbytery fundamentally changed the membership status of those persons who were under its oversight?”
We respond:
“In short, we maintain that the dissolution of Presbytery does not change the agreement that each of the members made at the time they became members. Our unity is in the truth of Scripture, and it is in our stated doctrine and practice as summarized in our six terms of communion.
Changing the “form” of organization from a Presbytery back into a state in which one teaching elder and two ruling Elders have the general oversight over the Societies does not alter our membership commitments or change the status of those who have already passed our communion examinations. Those who were formerly members we still consider to be members and those who were allowed to come to the communion table can still do so.”
We maintain that our brethren in Prince George (and it appears many others) have clearly and significantly altered their principles in regard to Church membership, and in regard to their principles of Church government, and we wonder when this change actually occurred and why it took this oath to bring their significantly altered position to light. It is evident that the principles of our recent Position Paper on Sessional Authority were at least practically adopted by the Prince George members approximately 10 years ago, when they extraordinarily covenanted with, and submitted to the rule of an Edmonton Session of Elders (not a Prince George Session). They did not protest at the time of their initial membership, nor did they protest when they were ruled by an extraordinary international Presbytery made up of Pastor Price, Pastor Edwards, Greg Barrow, Lyndon Dohms and David Hart. Are they now saying that their membership with us, even during all that time, was sinful as well? It is difficult to tell, since they have not revealed to us their positive position in any discernable way. By positive position we mean that they must prove it sinful for a Christian to own the authority of a Session that lives at a distance from them. Now that we have reverted back to a Session (albeit extraordinary), what has changed? One change since they covenanted with us initially is that Pastor Price has moved somewhat farther away from Prince George. However, we are still the same three elders to which they originally made promises. We can still communicate with one another just as easily as we could when we were together in Edmonton. We still can (and do) meet regularly as a Session. It remains to be seen what Scriptural argument they might devise to justify their current position—-whatever that might be. To date we hear much criticism of what we, as a Session, positively believe, but what do these disaffected brethren actually believe? Those who appear to be siding with them should take a long, hard look at what they are “not” saying, for they are “not” saying, in any discernable fashion, where they positively stand.
Next, it is stated by the brethren in Prince George that the problem with the Oath is that the Oath imposed by the Session entrapped them because the Session knew they could not swear it.
We testify before God that we did not know with certainty that the brethren in Prince George would refuse the Oath since they had not communicated their thoughts to us about the Position Paper on Sessional Authority even though they were invited to do so by the Session. We affirm, however, that even if a lawful authority knows that one cannot conscientiously swear an Oath that is lawful, it is still not unlawful to impose such an Oath when necessary (especially after the very matter objected to has been carefully explained by arguments from Scripture, history, and reason with sincere invitations to ask questions).
Consider the Solemn League and Covenant. Consider especially how this faithful covenant was imposed within the kingdom of Scotland by lawful authority.
Did that lawful covenant “entrap” those people who could not conscientiously swear it? Did not the lawful authorities at that time “know” that certain people would not and could not swear the Solemn League and Covenant? Was it then sinful for them to impose that lawful covenant upon the people? Frankly, we are astounded that those who call themselves Covenanters would raise such an objection. Such an objection was precisely that found in the mouths of those of sectarian and independent persuasion. It is not entrapment to enforce that which is biblically sound and morally good. Consider the objections offered by those who believed the Solemn League and Covenant would entrap those who could not conscientiously swear it and the answers to those objections by Mr. Gillespie (”Miscellany Questions—Chapter XVI”).
Objection 1 states that no Covenant (or Oath for that matter) ought to be imposed upon men contrary to their conscience:
“The covenant ought not to be compulsory but free. Good things grow evil when men’s consciences are thereunto forced.”
To which Mr. Gillespie replies:
“1. An ordinance enjoining the taking of it under a certain penalty were no other compulsion than was used by King Josiah [in 2 Chronicles 34:32, 33—Session] and others [king Asa in 2 Chronicles 15:12,13—RPNA (GM)], yea by this present parliament upon their own members, and upon ministers to be ordained, as is evident by the passages above expressed….
2. It is no tyranny over men’s consciences to punish a great and scandalous sin (such as the refusing and opposing of the covenant, or a dividing from it), although the offender in his conscience believe it to be no sin [not to take it—Session], yea, peradventure, believe t to be a duty [not to take it—Session, otherwise it had been tyranny over the conscience to punish those who killed the apostles, because they thought they were doing God good service, John xvi.2,3…."
Thus, the imposition of a lawful Oath is not tyrannical even when a severe penalty is threatened and executed against any who refuse to take it.
Objection 4 states that those who are forced to take a Covenant (or Oath) sacrifice their liberty of conscience:
"The army which hath served us so faithfully, and regained our liberties shall by this ordinance [covenant—Session] lose their own greatest liberty, which is the liberty of their consciences.”
To which Mr. Gillespie responds:
“If an ordinance, imposing the taking of the covenant under a considerable penalty, be to the army scandalum acceptum [a scandal taken—Session], the not passing of such an ordinance will be scandalum datum [a scandal given—Session] to the city of London, and to many thousands of the godly and well-affected of the kingdom, both ministers and people, who have faithfully adhered to and served the parliament, and will still hazard their lives and fortunes in pursuance of the ends of the covenant; yea, a horrible scandal to the reformed churches abroad, whose hearts were once comforted and raised up to expect better things.”
In other words, it is not only the consciences of those who take offence at the Oath that is imposed upon them that must be considered, but also the consciences of those who impose the Oath as a lawful Court of Christ (who would by consequence deny the Key of government given to them by Christ if they allowed members to refuse an Oath that acknowledges thel awfulness of the Court and reaffirms their membership agreement) as well as the consciences of those members that would be denied a hearing before the Court of Christ against the private sins of brethren that had passed through the stages of Matthew 18 or against the public sins of brethren. It is not the conscience of man that determines whether an Oath should be taken or signed—-it is lawfulness of the Oath on the basis of God’s Word that determines whether an Oath should be taken or signed. In the particular Oath that has been imposed by the Session, the substance of that Oath has been defended positively from Scripture, history and reason. We ask, who is practicing an implicit faith?